177 | Writing a Bestselling Book and Becoming an Expert in Your Industry with Megan Williams of the Self Publishing Agency
You are going to love this conversation, especially if you have "writing a book" on your bucket list! 📸 @hannershannahphoto
LISTEN TO THE EPISODE HERE:
We’re so excited to bring on an old friend, Megan Williams, who is the Founder & CEO of the Forbes featured publishing house, The Self Publishing Agency! In this conversation we talk about her journey of building her business, at what point she realized something needed to change if her business was going to succeed and become profitable and we also talk about the benefits of becoming an author as a business owner.
Megan has built a company where writers become authors, where their books become bestsellers and stories are turned into screenplays. Helping New York Times Bestsellers, Olympians, TV Personalities and everyday storytellers professionally publish their books, Megan and her team give agency to authors while turning up the volume on their stories.
Connect with Megan:
@megandubs
@theselfpublishingagency
http://theselfpublishingagency.com
Key Takeaways:
Organic Growth and Collaboration:
Megan's business grew organically by focusing on her strengths and bringing in experts to complement her skills. Collaborating with others who excel in areas where you may not is a key to success.
Profitable Scaling:
Scaling a business requires evaluating the true cost of services and charging accordingly. Megan emphasized the importance of accurately tracking time spent on clients and being upfront about what they'll receive for their investment.
Writing a Book for Business:
Writing a book can help business owners scale their businesses by offering valuable resources to clients or potential clients. It also positions them as authorities in their field, leading to more opportunities and contracts.
Overcoming Imposter Syndrome:
Megan encourages those hesitant to write a book due to imposter syndrome to remember that every book has a place on the shelf. You don't have to be the ultimate expert; you just need to share your knowledge and experience at your current stage.
Continuous Building:
Building doesn't always mean achieving perfection with each project. Sometimes it's about taking smaller steps, gaining experience, and being open to growth, which eventually leads to bigger successes.
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transcript
[00:00:00] Danielle Wiebe: Hi, Megan. Welcome to the podcast. I'm so excited to have you here today.
[00:00:05] Megan Williams: Nice to see you again. I love our, I love the plot points of our, friendship and how many times our lives have intersected. You gave us such a great launch pad when you, when your business was already established. And then I ran into you and we were both having babies.
[00:00:20] Danielle Wiebe: I know. So for people who don't know Megan we have been connected, honestly, I think it's been almost since the beginning. I'm pretty sure when we first connected, actually, You were speaking at an event and I was just starting my community
[00:00:36] Danielle Wiebe: and I remember coming up to you, I felt like a little fangirl and I was like, you were so great. I was like, you have to join us for. For an event and speak at my event. And so I basically just pitched her on the spot and we've been friends ever since. So that has been super
[00:00:53] Megan Williams: fun. I remember that. And we have a photo.
[00:00:55] Megan Williams: It came up in a, like in a memory for me recently. So I'm going to go and find that photo [00:01:00] so I can post it when we talk about this podcast, because it's like our baby photo together. I would love that. We were both doing this new little thing and hoping that maybe we could both help each other.
[00:01:11] Danielle Wiebe: That is so fun.
[00:01:12] Danielle Wiebe: I'm super excited, but it's funny because what I wanted to pull out of that though, which is so funny, I was really actually nervous to come up to you to talk to you because, when you see someone on a stage you're just like, oh my gosh, they have it all figured out. They know what they're talking about.
[00:01:29] Danielle Wiebe: They don't want to talk to me. So I was really nervous coming up to you. And I think it's just like a good reminder to people that, you're just a regular person, just like everyone else. And you've got your own, insecurities and things. And so I just think it's funny that when I came up to you, I was so nervous.
[00:01:45] Danielle Wiebe: And then. You were just so kind and down to earth. I was like, oh, okay. She's not scary.
[00:01:51] Megan Williams: Yeah, and the inverse is that when you came up, I'm like, I'm so flattered. Why is this girl coming up to me? Does she know that I just... wrote a book and that was the only thing. She's got [00:02:00] an entire community. Why is she even asking me to do any, she's, doesn't she know that I'm floppy?
[00:02:06] Danielle Wiebe: This is
[00:02:06] Megan Williams: awesome. I love it, but you're right. You didn't totally, it's a great reminder that, and especially if you think about one of the things, and we can talk about this in our business that we often do, but it's a nice reminder that. You'd like to think that you see people for who they are and what they are, but often, what you didn't see, and most, I always like to assume that what you see is what you get, and I hope people feel that about me, but one of the things that I Have to remind myself is that sometimes when you have seen somebody on stage or you've listened to their podcast for so long or what have you, I was just in LA and I went to go see a standup comedian.
[00:02:42] Megan Williams: And then I saw him at the restaurant afterwards. And then you immediately see somebody in a regular environment. Like that person was just drinking orange juice or that person had to put their kids to bed before they did this next thing. So if you give yourself a little bit of what did that person have to do to get here today, not.
[00:02:59] Megan Williams: In a [00:03:00] high level but in a literal way, like what got them out the door and then you very immediately, but that girl's probably just. Had to put her kids to bed before she came to do the next thing, or she probably packed lunches this morning, or she's probably halfway through three emails.
[00:03:15] Megan Williams: It's so true. It really puts us all on the same, we're all doing the same thing. Sometimes it's at different levels of others, but that doesn't actually mean that someone doesn't know what you're about or can figure, can relate
[00:03:27] Danielle Wiebe: to you. It's so true. ] Okay, let me ask you, because we haven't really dove into who you are yet.
[00:03:34] Danielle Wiebe: What got you into entrepreneurship, being your own business owner? How did you get into this crazy world?
[00:03:40] Megan Williams: It started based on, we'll pull it back to the stage that we would have met at. Yes. It started at, so I, the background, the thing that even got me on the stage in the first place was that I was with my partner for many years and he he [00:04:00] passed away from an incurable blood cancer when I was just 24 and He was only in his early thirties and similar to, I know lots of people can relate to this, but grief will throw you off kilter and it'll throw you off your course pretty hard.
[00:04:16] Megan Williams: And in my case, my, the thing that kind of brought me back to center was I found a diary that he had kept when he had been first diagnosed. And when I thumbed through it, he had written in the back of it, publish this book when the time is right. And reading those words. Publish this book when the time is right.
[00:04:38] Megan Williams: I one didn't know what It meant to publish a book and then I also didn't know what the time was right was supposed to mean But it felt like one of those breadcrumb moments where you're like, maybe I'm gonna just try a thing here and try and take this Take whatever is it's the sign is here and tried the next thing so I started [00:05:00] I eventually decided to start writing the story of And I'm not somebody who ever thought I was ever going to write a book.
[00:05:07] Megan Williams: Some people we talk to are like, I've always wanted to write a book. This was not me. I think I enjoyed writing, but the publishing part of it was something that I felt like that was meant for other people. I wrote the book and... I started doing what I believe other, what we all think happens in the movies, which I'm going to get paid a million dollars.
[00:05:29] Megan Williams: And then Oprah is going to have me on a show. I'll send her a thank you, like gift of a hairless cat. And then I'll be flown back and forth between LA just to do all of these very fancy million dollar fancy things. And that is not the case at all. So I was sitting on a. A manuscript that was very meaningful to me and started sending it to publishers, asking them like, I hope this is meaningful for you as well.
[00:05:58] Megan Williams: And I hope this is something that you [00:06:00] guys are interested in. And I had some very interested publishers, some of the big ones too, but as this, as. My, as I started having more conversations, I realized that this, because this information, this story and this experience, it was so personal to me that I don't know if I want it.
[00:06:20] Megan Williams: I decided I didn't want to play on anyone else's timelines and I didn't want to have anyone suggest that maybe some character development was required or some plots some plot changes were. important to make this book more interesting because I mean I can't develop myself as a character I'm only as simple as I am and what happened is what happened so I didn't want to be changing things to suit like a publisher's guess on what other people could want so I inevitably figured out who I would want on my team if I wanted to do this on my own and this [00:07:00] is where The entrepreneurial piece can come in just for an author alone.
[00:07:04] Megan Williams: You start assembling a team of people who know more than you do. So I hired a professional editor. I hired a professional book designer. And then I started asking every single person who had a cousin who had published a book, would you think your cousin would talk to me and tell me how they published their book without going through a publisher or what did they say to their publisher and ultimately decided that I would self published and it was a kind of it was.
[00:07:28] Megan Williams: A bit of an unpopular choice at the time because self publishing was still a little bit fringe and meant for the people who could not find a traditional publisher or were turned down by traditional publishers. But because my background's in marketing and PR and I was working in communications at the time, I figured I might be able to take a proper swing at it and be able to replicate what a traditional publisher was able to do.
[00:07:54] Megan Williams: But on my timeline. And with my story and not having to, wait four [00:08:00] years for somebody to say yes, I wasn't into this JK Rowling wait seven years dream story. I'm like, that's not for me. So that's an anomaly. That isn't the rule. So I did that and then it took off like wildfire, which is what brought.
[00:08:14] Megan Williams: Me to that stage. Probably six within six months of it being launched, if not shorter. And then that's what introduced me to you. You asked me to come in and do a workshop at some point. And after a few of those types of encounters, I started recognizing that There were other people who were like me, who might be not, or might be interested in doing, telling their story on their terms, whether that was a business book, a children's book, or a memoir.
[00:08:43] Megan Williams: There was something that was giving agency back to people that they were quite intrigued by. And then decided to keep assembling a team and get those people to help other, get my editor to help other editors and get my designer to help other authors. And then [00:09:00] ultimately that's what the self publishing agency became.
[00:09:02] Megan Williams: It was built out of a little parallel place in the market that no one was touching. There are other self publishing companies out there, of course, but we are, we, the way we do it is actually a little bit different. It operates more in the professional publishing sandbox and, we're the only agency in North North America that we know of that doesn't accept royalties. Again, we can, we want authors to have that control and we want you to in five years take your book and go and speak on a stage and be at Southwest by Southwest and us not be financially tied to somebody.
[00:09:35] Megan Williams: So we've got a little bit of a fringe business model, but it's something that. It's so fun. It's so fun because you get to, be in rooms with people like you doing really fun things and it overlaps in a lot of different worlds. So I like it a lot.
[00:09:50] Danielle Wiebe: So fun. That's so cool. And of course I know part of your story as well.
[00:09:54] Danielle Wiebe: And what I think is so cool about how you've been able to grow your [00:10:00] business is It seems like it has just grown super organically based on, yeah, your skill set and then also like the people that you surround yourself with and what I really love about what I see from your business, and I'd love for you to touch on this, is that you know what you do really well and then you bring other people On board to your team to support your clients who do what they do really well and so like collaboration and kind of community, which are things that we're really passionate about.
[00:10:31] Danielle Wiebe: Of course with our business is something that you do really well in your business. So I would love for you to maybe touch on that touch on the aspect of. Having, bringing in other people so that you know that you don't have to be good at everything because that's just unrealistic to think you're going to be amazing at marketing and you're going to be amazing at the actual writing and editing and the speaking and this and that.
[00:10:57] Danielle Wiebe: And so tell us a little bit about what [00:11:00] you've been able to do with your team.
[00:11:03] Megan Williams: You've nailed it. That's exactly what it is. I just started. I started asking people to work with us who were better at everything than I was. So for example, I wasn't about to start editing books because that is not something I am educated in.
[00:11:18] Megan Williams: I'm not, that's not a strong thing. I've got a lot of opinions, but I shouldn't be an editor. And the same goes for book designs. So instead of me, I know in when we start our own businesses, there's that thought of I should be doing all of this because it's a way of not. People use that phrase, you got a bootstrap and you got to grind in the beginning to make ends meet.
[00:11:37] Megan Williams: But I think actually I don't think, I know the reason we've been able to grow the business is actually because I wasn't doing it all. So I could stay in the lane of the things that made. That actually made a difference and I could also pay other people. So for example I wasn't I wasn't going to design your book, but I can pay somebody who will, [00:12:00] and they're going to do a way better job at it.
[00:12:01] Megan Williams: And now the presentation going into the public and being able to use that for marketing. For other people, for that author to be able to market us because their book looks beautiful. And for me to be able to talk about a book, it looks beautiful, not just something I decided to rip around on Canva with and say let's say that I made this and I'm going to make a bunch of money off of it.
[00:12:21] Megan Williams: So I strongly feel that. Growth can happen when you're pulling for the best of people. And I, it's really hard. I find I've tried to hire junior people along the way thinking that, Oh, if you could just hire a student, or if you could just hire somebody to. That could do this, but at a lesser rate than you charge in some cases, I've actually found that ends up being one more work and it costs me more than if I were to just hire somebody who's either my age and seniority level or [00:13:00] somebody who's even more senior than I am.
[00:13:02] Megan Williams: I found that to be a business accelerator for me. So long as the hourly rates are being covered and that person's job is being paid for, there's a lot, there's a lot. Of there's a lot of room for growth when you hire senior already, or you go senior versus. I don't know about you, but I to manage a student or an intern, because while there's a place for that in our business, it, I have found that took more of my time than I wanted it to, because you're trying to ultimately develop someone else when you're trying to develop your own business as well.
[00:13:36] Megan Williams: And that is actually. That's a lot of effort and energy. Totally,
[00:13:40] Danielle Wiebe: totally. I would love for you to speak on being able to scale your business obviously not just with your team but making your business profitable because you know we start with this idea and we have this concept of what we want to create.
[00:13:55] Danielle Wiebe: And often we get so excited about that. And we get excited about helping [00:14:00] clients and we're just like, okay, let's do this. And then we start taking on clients or, of course there's product based businesses out there too, but we start selling products. We start selling our services. And then all of a sudden we're like, oh, shoot, .
[00:14:13] Danielle Wiebe: We gotta make sure that we're actually covering our costs and making money. And what was that process like for you? When did you start realizing, Okay, this is something that, yes, I enjoy doing, but I need to make this profitable and sustainable long term, especially if I'm gonna have this as my... My main thing.
[00:14:34] Megan Williams: Yeah. I, so TSPA, I started it off the side of, in the evenings after I was finished my like corporate job. And then that contract ended for me. So it gave me this sort of this opportunity to decide, am I going to go for another contract or am I going to give this a real, am I going to give TSPA a real go at it?
[00:14:58] Megan Williams: My husband and I talked [00:15:00] about it and we're like, let's see, let's just try six months and see what we can do if I were to be doing this full time. What could happen? And so it worked, six months was enough to extend it another six months. There was enough people coming in the door and to feel like there was some genuine momentum, not just manufactured momentum that I created on Instagram.
[00:15:24] Megan Williams: There was enough movement and enough inquiry happening that proved that this model was something that was going to last. But what happened. Somewhere on like in the 10 to 14 month range was that I recognize I'm working so many hours, but actually not making very much money. And I appreciate that when we start, our rates are always lower because you want to.
[00:15:48] Megan Williams: Attract new clients and you want to be competitive with the marketplace. People will know that you're younger in the market or you're newer in the market. So you, your prices do have to reflect that [00:16:00] the one thing that's changed. Significantly for me, though, is when we brought in our who's now our chief operations officer.
[00:16:09] Megan Williams: She she was a lawyer in her previous career, and she came in and she said, could we just take an audit of how many hours you were spending per client versus what the client thinks they are getting and to be. To be very clear, explicit about what I mean by that is, for example, we had a thousand dollar package that I was claiming as I think that meant that an author would get.
[00:16:39] Megan Williams: 10 hours of my support and coaching time and project management. But then when we actually did an audit of how much time was being spent per author, I wasn't actually accounting for every. Email question that they had any kind of quick. Let me could I just ask you a quick [00:17:00] question texts that were taking 30 minutes of back and forth conversation that 10 hours that I in my mind had just elusively decided it was going to be worth 1, 000 was that I was only counting face to face meetings, and I was never calculating how many.
[00:17:17] Megan Williams: emails, how much work am I doing on this person's behalf behind the scenes? So I was only billing for face to face time. So that would be, that was something that really changed our what we were charging, and it changed how we were able to communicate our time with authors as well. The value ended up being there, but I all of a sudden was being...
[00:17:37] Megan Williams: Much more discerning with our time and it allowed us to prove maybe the next leap is maybe we have a 1500 package and that actually accounts for a lot of the just a quick question emails that were happening. So anyways I'm not sure if that answers your question, but that's certainly something that allowed us to scale.
[00:17:54] Megan Williams: And to also ensure that we are profitable as we were scaling just what I was [00:18:00] feeling before, which is 1000. And then like, why did I just. Why am I working 12 hour days and not making any money? It's because I actually worked. five hours on a, with an author, but not face to face. So I never counted it.
[00:18:13] Megan Williams: Totally.
[00:18:16] Danielle Wiebe: And those boundaries are hard to create with clients after the fact. In, in creating packages that actually account for your time and have some of that buffer in there, it also allows you to show up, I believe, better for your clients. They're getting a better service and they're getting a better version of you when you're charging more, right?
[00:18:37] Danielle Wiebe: And that's what I always think about when, because when I make buying decisions or when I am looking to have support, whether it be within my business or just in my personal life, obviously yes, price always has a determining factor, but if I'm going to have a specific experience from working with someone and I know what that experience might look like.[00:19:00]
[00:19:00] Danielle Wiebe: I'm going to be more attracted to that. And especially if I have, known that person or I've been referred to that person from someone else, like I'm willing to pay a bit more to have that experience rather than, Oh, this person's just cheaper. So I'm going to go with them. And if you're not going to have that experience.
[00:19:19] Danielle Wiebe: Obviously this is talking about service based businesses that is so valuable for clients and I think we don't really necessarily value that as much as we should as, as business owners.
[00:19:31] Megan Williams: I agree and there's something that I had to shift in my mind. And again, I attribute all of this to era who came in and basically was the has been my internal business coach the entire time.
[00:19:45] Megan Williams: But To that end one, as you said, if we know somebody is going to have an experience and as you said, and if you're upfront about what they will be receiving for it, the exchange feels very genuine that way. And it versus that, as you said, midstream all of a sudden [00:20:00] being like, what do you mean I'm over hours?
[00:20:02] Megan Williams: You didn't tell me that this was good that you were going to be charging me for email so being up front about what you are what you estimate something taking such as this will take five behind the scenes admin time. This will take five client meetings and about five, design hours or whatever the person's role is.
[00:20:22] Megan Williams: The other thing is I was reminded of this just last week, actually, I was talking to a potential client and their comment to me was like, oh, that was a little bit more expensive or that, that estimate came in a bit more expensive than I was expecting.
[00:20:37] Megan Williams: And I. Let them know that frankly, we employ a lot of our, a lot of the women that we work with are all living in Vancouver and they are all professionals at their job. We don't offshore this. We are not doing up like Upwork or Fiverr and then pretending and masking it to be. You know [00:21:00] something that's professional or that we have control over.
[00:21:02] Megan Williams: So you are getting a premium Service for somebody who like lives in Vancouver. So there's a certain you are supporting another like local business when you purchase a design service this way and it Totally reframed our conversation and she became far more interested in continuing hearing about the estimate and what if this was going to, she said, it actually felt really good for her to know that she was going to be supporting somebody locally or working with somebody locally versus that thought of this business is just going to gouge me and offshore this project.
[00:21:40] Megan Williams: And so it was a reminder that. Sometimes pulling the the curtain back just a little bit on why something can cost a lot of money, because the thing is that if somebody wants to lowball you or think that your services aren't what they are, what you [00:22:00] believe them to be billing at, they actually aren't going to be, we've learned many times over, and I can finally say this with very certain, if somebody doesn't believe that your services are what you Are charging for they will be and they will be a perpetual nightmare to work with.
[00:22:17] Danielle Wiebe: Yes. 100%. 100%. It's so interesting. They're
[00:22:22] Megan Williams: constantly looking for to squeeze the most amount of juice out of you, to for them to feel like, to get you to prove your own value.
[00:22:32] Danielle Wiebe: Oh my goodness. No I want to second what you said because we have noticed this over and over again when it comes to working with, whether it be with clients or with people for our events or sponsors and things like that.
[00:22:45] Danielle Wiebe: It's always the people that are the actually like the VIP, the people that have paid the most that are. the easiest to work with and the most enjoyable to work with. It's wild. And and they value what they're [00:23:00] paying. And so I, I think it is a mindset shift though as a business owner, because it's definitely scary raising your prices.
[00:23:08] Danielle Wiebe: I get that. But when you start to raise your prices, you're also raising the level of the clients. that are going to work with you or the customers that are going to come in your door, they are at that level where they're wanting to invest in something and they value that thing. Because it's if you buy something at the dollar store, you don't care if You step on it or if, it gets lost or whatever.
[00:23:35] Danielle Wiebe: Whereas, if you buy something from Nordstrom and, you've paid a lot of money for it, you're going to make sure that you take care of that thing. I think it makes a huge difference.
[00:23:44] Megan Williams: That's a great analogy. And I'm thinking back to hearing the advice and I still probably, honestly, I still hear it where people are like, you should charge more.
[00:23:51] Megan Williams: And it still scares me. I'm, I had a package that was 400 when we started. And when somebody was like, yeah, I'll buy that. I was like, really?[00:24:00]
[00:24:01] Danielle Wiebe: I know. That's totally true. Like the first sales that you have, you're like, someone's actually going to pay me to do something that I want to do.
[00:24:07] Danielle Wiebe: This is crazy.
[00:24:09] Megan Williams: Yeah. And then let's, let's, for the people who listen to this podcast, that might already be in that space of knowing that people are willing to buy a thing, but still unsure about how to raise their prices in a way that feels comfortable. My only suggestion then is if you don't feel ready to raise your prices or you don't feel whatever industry you're in can handle it right now like the market can't handle a higher price point, then I would say then go back and audit your hours.
[00:24:40] Megan Williams: And that might be the shift that you make. So you're not actually changing your prices, but you might be changing the amount of hours that you work on something. So therefore you can articulate to A client and say, you can buy this for 500, but it is going to get you only seven hours of work. And this is what that would look like, or you can buy [00:25:00] the next tier up and this is what that would get you.
[00:25:02] Megan Williams: So therefore you aren't raising your prices. You're just being more discerning about how you're spending your
[00:25:06] Danielle Wiebe: time. Yeah. Or offering almost a, like a package that's more resources or something that's something digital that you can actually offer them rather than spending your time.
[00:25:18] Danielle Wiebe: So I, I agree. There's lots of different ways to do it. And I feel like we could talk about this forever, but I do want to ask you another question specifically to do with writing books, because I think a lot of people, it's something that's on their bucket list of what they want to do one day. And so I would love to hear from you.
[00:25:36] Danielle Wiebe: What do you think the benefit is for business owners, specifically in being able to write a book ? Why do you think that would be something that they might want to put as a priority?
[00:25:49] Megan Williams: That's a good question. I think when you and I were talking about it earlier is just how there's kind of two benefits.
[00:25:55] Megan Williams: I think on one end, it helps business owners scale because we have an [00:26:00] author. For example, she has a 4000 person wait list right now her business is generally either workshops and or hourly rates. But, she needed to have something that she could say to those 4, 000 people, like while you're waiting, buy this book, and then you'll be ahead of the start line by the time we're ready to start working together.
[00:26:21] Megan Williams: And I think that you don't need to have 4, 000 people for that to apply to. For some people, writing a book on their area of expertise is something that they either offer to... Potential clients as a, can you, if you read this, then then let's consider working together or it can be read this while you wait.
[00:26:41] Megan Williams: Or it can be a value add as when we start working together, I will be asking you to go through this workbook with me and it will enhance your experience. You'll be able to get more out of our work together is if you were following along in this book, because I've just dumped everything in my brain down into this book.
[00:26:59] Megan Williams: So I [00:27:00] would say on one hand, it's a scalable model to. It's an investment, of course, but it allows the business to scale. Obviously we're all in the realm of if you have to in invest in your own business to be able to allow it to scale up. And then the other part of publishing that I think is in addition to helping a business scale is also to present as an authority.
[00:27:25] Megan Williams: One of our authors, Bill, was saying the other day how, he had written a book on marketing and he has been able to transfer his skills to health care, to real estate, to everything. But he was in a meeting and he was talking about a theory in marketing that this company could use.
[00:27:42] Megan Williams: And he's like, and I got the contract because He's like, I'm the smartest guy in the room. Once they, once I slid a book across the table and I was the one who wrote the book on that subject, he's like, I'm the smartest guy in the room. Go ahead and say, there's no way you're going to say no to me now. So he said, it's [00:28:00] given him it's given him an authority and, a reputation for, or a leg up the same way a MBA does for some people, but to write a book on an area of expertise is we see it time and time again, it just gives people a leg up in what they're able to talk about because now you're not just a business owner, but as you've so kindly done to me at so many of your workshops, I get introduced as a business owner and then also a bestselling author.
[00:28:26] Megan Williams: So it sounds nice. When I get introduced somewhere,
[00:28:30] Danielle Wiebe: I agree. And, okay, I want to ask you one more question because I feel like this is something that's probably percolating in a few people's minds, including myself. What if you have an idea for a book, but you feel like am I the best person to be writing this book about this topic?
[00:28:47] Danielle Wiebe: I'm not really the expert in this. And I'm sure you hear this from your clients all the time. What do you tell people when they feel like, okay, I have this idea. This is what I want to write. Or this is[00:29:00] this is the topic that I want to talk about, but they feel this imposter syndrome of. I don't know.
[00:29:07] Danielle Wiebe: I'm not the right person to do this because this person is better at this than me or that person already has a book that's about that topic. Tell us what your thoughts are
[00:29:16] Megan Williams: on that. I love this conversation because my thought is If you don't write that book, then should somebody else, do you want to go put that work on somebody else who you believe to be the expert and you say, you guys should actually write that book.
[00:29:28] Megan Williams: Whereas really, I think if you're a business owner and you are running a successful show, you already know what works. You already, you've already, you've probably extracted theory and information and data and process from other people's books. Thanks. That we could just decide, as we talked about, you could decide that those are the scary people, those are the people doing the actual things.
[00:29:55] Megan Williams: Maybe I'm not the right person to do that. Maybe they're on stage and I shouldn't be on stage.[00:30:00] But ultimately what happens is that if you are running a business and you... And I think it's really important to know something about your niche, because, you're like for you, for example, Danielle, you've got an extraordinary community of people building, like building foundational pillars in their career moves and in their business dreams.
[00:30:19] Megan Williams: That's not to say that a book like that doesn't exist in the world. But. You are able to touch on a niche that actually is less common than a general business book. And the other thing is that people, especially whether you're, honestly, in every genre, we see this. No one reads one business book and says, I've nailed it.
[00:30:39] Megan Williams: I got it. I'm going to do it. So true. And then I'm never going to read another business book. No one ever reads one self help book and then says, yeah, I've been helped. I don't need to ever read anything like that again. We all pursue the genres that we want information from, and we do that over and over again.
[00:30:58] Megan Williams: Oh, you don't read one fiction book? [00:31:00] Well, I've been entertained. On to the next genre. So the idea is, I do believe that, this is a bit of a cheesy book analogy, but I do believe that there is space on the shelf for every book. And a lot of that onus relies on the expert or, Just the storytelling.
[00:31:16] Megan Williams: We don't even need to be an expert to write a book. You just need to be knowledgeable and thoughtful and organized in your thinking, or you hire us and we make you that I don't believe you even need to be an expert. I think you just need to know what you're really good at and what you can speak to.
[00:31:33] Megan Williams: So for example, you might like, you may never want to call yourself an expert because that that does that word sits weird with you. But I can say that you are, you've built out a career on building a community or giving people in a community the pillars to success. So you're pretty qualified to write a book on that, I think.
[00:31:52] Danielle Wiebe: Yeah. Thank you. And so we'll just, we'll sign the contract after this podcast. I wanted to ask that question because I [00:32:00] think, what's so interesting as you were talking, because I get this question a lot or I get a lot of our community or clients or mastermind members that want to do something right.
[00:32:09] Danielle Wiebe: Like it doesn't necessarily have to be writing a book, but maybe it's launching a podcast or speaking on a stage or what have you. And so it's so funny because. The way that you explain that is exactly how I would also explain it to them when it comes to other things. But it's so interesting and I don't know if it's because a book feels so official.
[00:32:30] Danielle Wiebe: Like for example, launching a podcast, I'd be like, Oh, just, just start and you're going to get better at as time goes on and book feels so tangible and final that it feels just that extra level of scary. So I would love to hear your thoughts. anyone ever said that to you before?
[00:32:48] Danielle Wiebe: A book just feels so final. It's printed and then you can't change it or it's printed. No one said it in the way that
[00:32:54] Megan Williams: you have, but I think that's, I think you're right. I think it gives people the reason [00:33:00] it makes somebody an expert or the reason it gives somebody that that when You're presented into a room or somebody introduces you the reason people lead with author in the like across the world no matter whether it's trade or self published or however it's been done.
[00:33:16] Megan Williams: It's because it's very hard. It's a really big thing. It's a very tangible thing that lives ultimately in forever. I would say. That to help round the curve on, or the round that edgy feeling about, maybe I need to wait until I am better at my job to do something so finite. The thought is that I think you can write at every point in your life.
[00:33:42] Megan Williams: You write what you know at this stage. And then you can either release a second edition when more things have come to light or, and you make that a bulkier book. Or you write a brand new book because you. Are building on the thing that you became good at in the first place. [00:34:00] So I'm trying to think of for example, Elizabeth Gilbert, I know she was in Vancouver recently, and it felt like if you follow the business babes, you probably knew 85 people in that room, minimum. , so for example, she has written a ton of books and I don't know the number, but her first big hit was Eat, Pray, Love. But the one that actually catapulted her into like onstage success, despite Hollywood movies or whatever, the one that like, that could be argued that caused the biggest ripple across the world was Big Magic.
[00:34:37] Megan Williams: And she has written many books in
[00:34:39] Danielle Wiebe: between. Yeah. Yeah. True. Some
[00:34:41] Megan Williams: of them are like, not that good. And she wasn't that good in Vancouver, and I'll say that to her face.
[00:34:47] Danielle Wiebe: Yeah. So interesting. That's a good perspective.
[00:34:50] Megan Williams: For example, if you think about her stage career, she went and vulnerably stood up in a room of 300 in Vancouver, and general sentiment was like, she didn't have a new [00:35:00] book to promote, so she didn't have, she didn't have the next big magic thing, but she still did it anyway, she still got up there, and she still just shared what she knew for this period in her life, and then she'll probably go away in three years, she's gonna come back with a massive hit.
[00:35:16] Megan Williams: But you still just keep building on yourself and some might be, some books might be not as strong as the others, but then sometimes you hit. And it's not, every time you write or every time you write a chapter or every time you publish a book and that's your profession, I think, It's not realistic to think that everyone's gonna be, unless you're Shania Twain, you're not like, you're not doing hit after hit, you're building, right?
[00:35:43] Megan Williams: So books in between make somebody ready for the next big one. The contract, the smaller contracts that people take in between big projects make them eligible for the next big project.
[00:35:56] Danielle Wiebe: So good. I think that's such a good reminder. Just in, [00:36:00] business and life in general, like just because you are, yeah, just because let's say you got a big project or you maybe you are published somewhere and you're like, Oh, now I just have to like out do that last thing.
[00:36:14] Danielle Wiebe: That's not really realistic. And so I love, yeah, just continue to build and continue to put value into the world and yeah, that's such a good perspective. I love that so much. I want to ask you super scary,
[00:36:29] Megan Williams: isn't it? It is oh, I should just keep because like building. In our minds, I think building suggests that you're building like better all of the time, but sometimes building is just I just needed about five more micro mini projects to make sure that I was either financially stable, or I had some work experience that was going to make me eligible for the next thing and get me into the next room.
[00:36:52] Megan Williams: So that's what I think Elizabeth Gilbert's Vancouver tour was, it was just a mini build. Yeah. She doesn't have, she didn't have the next big [00:37:00] magic ready for us. We wanted it, but she didn't have it, but that's okay.
[00:37:03] Danielle Wiebe: So good. Okay. I want to ask you what you are most proud of, of your entrepreneurial journey so far.
[00:37:12] Megan Williams: That's such a cheesy answer, Daniel.
[00:37:15] Danielle Wiebe: That's why I asked this question because it leads up into a cheesy answer and you just, you have to say it.
[00:37:23] Megan Williams: I think my initial thought is like, Oh, I'm going to I'm really proud of Forbes and then I was really proud of like the variety article, but one of our authors we're now producers on a film with her, of her book being adapted to a movie.
[00:37:34] Megan Williams: Those feel like really sexy like, you know, splashy things to be proud of, but. Actually, if I go and if you strip all media accolades out of anything, the thing I feel most proud of is the same thing that I think most of our authors actually feel proud of when their book goes out into the world. And it's that we are helping to shepherd [00:38:00] Books out into libraries and bookshelves and homes and conversations that they were never, that story was never going to live in before that book came out.
[00:38:12] Megan Williams: There's an unquantifiable ripple effect that happens when a book comes out that it will Books will be read by people you will never meet It like your story will sit at a dining room table or be referenced over coffee with someone and you will never know who that Conversation is with What that sparked for somebody, if it changed how they cared for somebody, if it changed that they understood breast cancer differently, if they changed, you know, and so that's the cheesy part of it because I can't touch it.
[00:38:44] Megan Williams: And for us as a business, if we're doing, we, I know that's how an author feels and we get that almost exponentially because if we're pumping out, 50 books a year and helping different authors, we get that. It's this unquantifiable ripple piece that we don't know [00:39:00] where all of these books are going and we don't know whose lives they're changing, but it's, it feels really good.
[00:39:05] Megan Williams: It's really sleep easy, Danielle. I fall sleep really easily at night knowing it's good stuff.
[00:39:10] Danielle Wiebe: That's amazing. And I feel like as you're saying that, I'm like, I just feel like going on a retreat and bringing a lot of books and reading for two days straight. But in reality, I have two babies, two under two, so probably not happening in the next.
[00:39:26] Danielle Wiebe: few months anyways. But thank you for that inspiring picture that you painted. I love that. And thank you for being on the podcast. I love you. I love everything you do. I'm so grateful that we connected all those years ago. Can you tell people how they can connect with you, how they can?
[00:39:43] Danielle Wiebe: potentially reach out to you if they're interested in writing a book or if they just want to connect with you because you're a cool person and they just want to be friends.
[00:39:52] Megan Williams: I'd love you all to slide into my DMs as my new friends. You can connect with TSPA. We have kept it really [00:40:00] consistent and really memorable on purpose across all channels and just the self publishing agency everywhere.
[00:40:08] Megan Williams: And then if you feel like getting all close and personal, I'm Megan, M E G A N D U B S. Megan Dubs. It's a high school reference for me on Instagram. I love that.
[00:40:21] Danielle Wiebe: So cool. Oh, so good. Thank you so much for joining us. And also exciting. Megan's going to be a part of our Passion to Profit.
[00:40:29] Danielle Wiebe: Challenge so if you want to join us for that as well, definitely check that out and we're going to dive deeper with Megan there as well. But thank you for being on the podcast. I appreciate you. And I always love our conversations.
[00:40:41] Megan Williams: Me too, Danielle. I'm really looking forward to Passion for Profit.
[00:40:43] Megan Williams: So thank you.